Comments on: Art Flotsam

By: Mike

Mike — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:21:06 +0000

One other aspect of the running of the bulls or the Iverean orange throwing Carnival is that they are well publicized in advance (being traditional and enshrined in the culture) and draw tourism and the dollars tourists bring to the city.

Not that it eliminates the need to take some responsibility for our actions and our messes, which is a good idea in general. But cities don’t mind cleaning up if they feel they’re coming out ahead on the deal.

By: Erik

Erik — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 09:24:13 +0000

I wholeheartedly agree on both the value of such events and the need for a leave-no-traces policy.

Regarding Pillow Fight in particular, I think it would be pretty easy to institute a No Down Pillows policy (though enforcement would probably be either honor system or communal shaming/shunning). But when I went to the 2007 pillow fight there actually was a significant clean-up brigade – it didn’t seem to be organized by anyone in particular, just a few people handing out trash bags and a lot of people (myself included, he added smugly) filling them up.

Perhaps events like this could create some sort of incentive to clean up by offering some kind of after-party for cleaner-uppers. This would both get the job done and create a sense of camaraderie among the most dedicated participants.

By: Rachel Weidinger

Rachel Weidinger — Mon, 09 Mar 2009 23:32:39 +0000

I think maybe there is a thing in groups of people that NEEDS (or needed?) to make a big mess in a playful way. Thank you for bringing cultural history into this conversation (oranges.) I recently saw video somewhere about the colored flour throwing festival in Galaxidi, Greece. (So visually similar to that thing in the desert!) And the ThaI Songkran festival. And the La Tomatina in Spain.

Maybe we need to make a mess together. Hmmm…I wonder if the city would be more amenable if it were a cioppino fight.

By: TweedBeetle

TweedBeetle — Mon, 09 Mar 2009 22:31:26 +0000

Sadly, part of the emotional appeal of the flash mob idea is that things end as magically abruptly as they’re started, leaving others to wonder and marvel in their wake. Having to stop, carefully clean up and then put away your toys kind of removes the irresponsible fun of doing something surreal, then RUNIN AWAY to a bar for drinx and jocularity afterwards. It’s for this reason that i prefer concepts that don’t leave an unhappy mess like pies or pillows. I think the best thing that anybody can hope to do is make their opinions and voices heard at the outset [="remember people, no dripping zombie blood next friday!"=] if it becomes a mantra, public pressure can help steer it into an eventual moopless outcome.

By: Colin

Colin — Mon, 09 Mar 2009 22:28:49 +0000

@david Yes there may not be any official organizers, it is as I said essentially an “anarchistic celebratory expression of the community.” However, there are a number of people who promote the event, and many more who participate without any thought towards the resultant messy aftermath.

This is why I used the phrase “the responsibility of participation” if you are choosing to participate in an event and especially if you are promoting the event you should also take some level of responsibility for the cleanup — this is the essence of Leave No Trace.

…and yes I believe that being a UNCCH Observer counts as a participant who shares some responsibility even though the UNCCH did not bring any pillows to the event.

By: david

david — Mon, 09 Mar 2009 22:14:16 +0000

Doesn’t anyone realize that their hasn’t been an organizer for the pillow fight since the first one four years ago? Nobody wants to risk appearing to the authorities as the person ‘in charge’, and so nobody is organizing clean up.

By: Colin

Colin — Mon, 09 Mar 2009 22:06:23 +0000

@Flint I didn’t go to any of the earlier Pillow Fights, but others have echoed this same dismay at the lack of any cleanup plan. I personally didn’t see any attempt to promote cleanup at the 2009 Pillow Fight.

In the case of Pillow Fight, I doubt simple encouragement and promotion of Leave No Trace will work. I think an actual workable cleanup plan is required which is a tall order.

By: Flint

Flint — Mon, 09 Mar 2009 21:41:51 +0000

I’ve witnessed the amount of MOOP (Matter Out Of Place) that occurred with the pillow fight event three years ago and was disheartened by the aftermath. I assumed that the those who had put the event together had worked out a clean up plan. I had assumed wrong. For what it’s worth, I used a pillow without feathers and made sure I disposed of it correctly. Yeah, the Leave No Trace ethos is pounded into my skull at this point.

Another factor (personal observation) is that many of the participants at these events now are not necessarily Burning Man attendees and may not know about or understand the Leave No Trace mantra. This may be filed under some-one-else-will-clean-up-after-me mentality. Is it right? Certainly not. If this particular event wants to succeed in a betterment of itself, the producers need to educate participants about the necessity of cleaning up after themselves and perhaps have a clean up plan as well.

By: San Francisco Might Try to Shut Down Pillow Fight & Other Events

San Francisco Might Try to Shut Down Pillow Fight & Other Events — Mon, 09 Mar 2009 20:19:33 +0000

[...] – CatCubed [...]

By: David Nichols

David Nichols — Mon, 09 Mar 2009 20:09:52 +0000

Very nice summary.

This topic coming up again recently reminded me of some shots I got when I happened to be rolling through Justin Herman Plaza early on the morning on Feb 15th last year:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidnin/sets/72157603922245076/

That’s A LOT of feathers!!

-David